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Question:

she NEVER was a solar goddess — ATB, Kosmos

Response:

"Dianus" is clearly, in Latin, a masculine nominative of  "Diana".

Yes, "Dianus" would be a Roman name, but there doesn’t seem to be a Roman god called Dianus. name — which in this case will need another explanation.  We do at least know that the month of January was dedicated to him, not because it was ‘two-faced’, looking back at the old year and forward to at the new, but because it fell between winter and spring

And remember that the old Roman year opened at the Kalends of March. But Janus was a very old Roman god, carried over from the Etruscans. His worship was more predominant in the period when Rome was ruled by kings; he began to take a less prominent role as Jupiter Optimus Maximus (and the triad of Jupiter/Juno/Minerva, the only purely indigenous Roman gods) became more important during the early Republic. I seriously doubt that Janus was ever called "Dianus". To make a connection would be really stretching it.

Response:

"Dianus" is clearly, in Latin, a masculine nominative of  "Diana".

[big snip] Kice, did you know Titania was derived from Diana? I think that’s sort of charming. Alice

Response:

How, if I may ask, is Titania derived from Diana? Isxios?

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Dianus" is clearly, in Latin, a masculine nominative of  "Diana". [big snip] Kice, did you know Titania was derived from Diana? I think that’s sort of charming. Alice

Response:

Too long to quote; well, Dianus is another form of Janus (see Graves, TWG), masculine counterpart of Diana. — ATB, Kosmos

Response:

I see. Janus, a uniquely Roman God is the male counterpart of Diana, at best a borrowed Goddess from the Greeks? Color me skeptical, but I always saw Apollo as the counterpart to Artemis/Diana. I am also missing the link between the names Dianus and Janus. One would figure Janus, a god of doorways and transitions, to be more along the lines of a counterpart to Hekate. Isxios

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Too long to quote; well, Dianus is another form of Janus (see Graves, TWG), masculine counterpart of Diana. — ATB, Kosmos

Response:

How, if I may ask, is Titania derived from Diana?

I confess, I don’t know. It’s something I read that stuck with me and I can’t source it. Two guesses: either completely made up by Shakespeare, riffing on Diana. Or, Ti-Diana as in Petite-Diana, a not uncommon Louisiana-French formation; I have met a Ti-Jean. It may have come from France; a lot of fairy stuff did. Alice – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "Dianus" is clearly, in Latin, a masculine nominative of  "Diana". [big snip] Kice, did you know Titania was derived from Diana? I think that’s sort of charming. Alice

Response:

D(j)anus Janus, as for the transformation of the jod in D(j)eus Zeus (though it saved the "d" in Dianus). Counterparts? Well, very hard to set a real counterpart when one finds that the same god would be a manifestation of a year’s loop (Apollo was attached to the sun only in recent classic times)…. See R. Graves (TWG) for references, although often Graves seems to be very "vague"…. — ATB, Kosmos – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I see. Janus, a uniquely Roman God is the male counterpart of Diana, at best a borrowed Goddess from the Greeks? Color me skeptical, but I always saw Apollo as the counterpart to Artemis/Diana. I am also missing the link between the names Dianus and Janus. One would figure Janus, a god of doorways and transitions, to be more along the lines of a counterpart to Hekate. Isxios Too long to quote; well, Dianus is another form of Janus (see Graves, TWG), masculine counterpart of Diana. — ATB, Kosmos

Response:

How, if I may ask, is Titania derived from Diana? I confess, I don’t know. It’s something I read that stuck with me and I can’t source it. Two guesses: either completely made up by Shakespeare, riffing on Diana. Or, Ti-Diana as in Petite-Diana, a not uncommon Louisiana-French formation; I have met a Ti-Jean. It may have come from France; a lot of fairy stuff did. Alice

I see. May I suggest a book or two? 1: Greek Religion by Walter Burkert 2: The Gods of the Greeks by Carl Kerenyi These are great places to start learning about the ancient Greek Gods. You may then read up on Roman Religion and make comparissons. Isxios

Response:

I think Diana and Apollo are counterparts in the sense that they are both the archer Gods. Not to mention twins in Olympian and Roman mythology. Isxios

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – D(j)anus Janus, as for the transformation of the jod in D(j)eus Zeus (though it saved the "d" in Dianus). Counterparts? Well, very hard to set a real counterpart when one finds that the same god would be a manifestation of a year’s loop (Apollo was attached to the sun only in recent classic times)…. See R. Graves (TWG) for references, although often Graves seems to be very "vague"…. — ATB, Kosmos I see. Janus, a uniquely Roman God is the male counterpart of Diana, at best a borrowed Goddess from the Greeks? Color me skeptical, but I always saw Apollo as the counterpart to Artemis/Diana. I am also missing the link between the names Dianus and Janus. One would figure Janus, a god of doorways and transitions, to be more along the lines of a counterpart to Hekate. Isxios Too long to quote; well, Dianus is another form of Janus (see Graves, TWG), masculine counterpart of Diana. — ATB, Kosmos

Response:

I think Diana and Apollo are counterparts in the sense that they are both the archer Gods. Not to mention twins in Olympian and Roman mythology. Isxios

Since Appolo is also named Phoebos ( The sun god ) after his victory uppon the snake Python, at Delphi ( temple of the Pythies, oracles…) and that his sister Artemis (Diana) became the Moon goddess after this. Yes, the reverse of the meaning have made them counterparts. But Before the winning of Appolo at Delphi, she was a "diurn" goddess, As was the sun  female in several very old tradition. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – D(j)anus Janus, as for the transformation of the jod in D(j)eus Zeus (though it saved the "d" in Dianus). Counterparts? Well, very hard to set a real counterpart when one finds that the same god would be a manifestation of a year’s loop (Apollo was attached to the sun only in recent classic times)…. See R. Graves (TWG) for references, although often Graves seems to be very "vague"…. — ATB, Kosmos I see. Janus, a uniquely Roman God is the male counterpart of Diana, at best a borrowed Goddess from the Greeks? Color me skeptical, but I always saw Apollo as the counterpart to Artemis/Diana. I am also missing the link between the names Dianus and Janus. One would figure Janus, a god of doorways and transitions, to be more along the lines of a counterpart to Hekate. Isxios Too long to quote; well, Dianus is another form of Janus (see Graves, TWG), masculine counterpart of Diana. — ATB, Kosmos

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I think Diana and Apollo are counterparts in the sense that they are both the archer Gods. Not to mention twins in Olympian and Roman mythology. Isxios Since Appolo is also named Phoebos ( The sun god ) after his victory uppon the snake Python, at Delphi ( temple of the Pythies, oracles…) and that his sister Artemis (Diana) became the Moon goddess after this. Yes, the reverse of the meaning have made them counterparts. But Before the winning of Appolo at Delphi, she was a "diurn" goddess, As was the sun  female in several very old tradition.

Would you cite the very old traditions for making Diana (a Roman goddess) into a sun goddess? So far, I haven’t found any reference to any god named "Dianus" in Roman mythology, only in "Aradia" which has been discounted several times as a fraud.

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I think Diana and Apollo are counterparts in the sense that they are both the archer Gods. Not to mention twins in Olympian and Roman mythology. Isxios Since Appolo is also named Phoebos ( The sun god ) after his victory uppon the snake Python, at Delphi ( temple of the Pythies, oracles…) and that his sister Artemis (Diana) became the Moon goddess after this. Yes, the reverse of the meaning have made them counterparts. But Before the winning of Appolo at Delphi, she was a "diurn" goddess, As was the sun  female in several very old tradition. Would you cite the very old traditions for making Diana (a Roman goddess) into a sun goddess? So far, I haven’t found any reference to any god named "Dianus" in Roman mythology, only in "Aradia" which has been discounted several times as a fraud.

Kice here: First, a couple of comments.  1. To Isxios–I seem to recall (I haven’t rechecked) in the Homeric Hymn to Apollon that Artemis was one of the goddesses present/helping at his birth.  Of course, one should never be surprised at the abilities of neonate gods or goddesses, and perhaps Artemis was just born and immediately helped midwife her brother’s birth.  Certainly in iconography and mythology the two seem often represented as acting together as "Terrible Twins".   2. To Abraxas and Claudia — I too doubt that Diana was ever a solar goddess.  The "connection" of course is that her name is cognate with the Indo-European word for god/bright sky/day/etc. from which the names of major deities in many traditions are derived — Zeus, Tyr, Dyaus, Iuppiter for instance (as well as deus and diurnal).  My point is that Diana as the "Bright One" would more probably be the bright full moon than the bright sun.   Next, I thought it germane to repost my earlier comments and quotes on the subject of Diana and Dianus and Ianus. From other posts I’ve seen it’s clear that the Graves is one of the "mythologists" whom Adrian Room refers to.  Here’s my previous post (from 16 August): "Dianus" is clearly, in Latin, a masculine nominative of  "Diana".  Here’s the entry on "Diana" in Adrian Room’s _Who’s Who in Classical Mythology_ [QUOTE] Diana, the Roman goddess equivalent to the Greek Artemis, has a name that very probably derives from Latin _deus_, ‘god’, as does the name of Zeus.  Traditionally and popularly, she is not only the goddess of hunting, but the goddess of the moon, for which, according to one mythologist, the old Latin name was Jana.  Diana was invoked first as ‘Deiva Jana’ (the goddess Jana), which became ‘Deivjana’ and finally ‘Diana’.  Her name is thus related to that of Janus.  Be that as it may (and one suspects that it may not), we must not overlook that behind these names, and even _deus_ itself, lies the root _di-_ , ‘bright’, so that the overall concept of bright = god = sky = day (Latin _dies_, which also may be behind her name) is a complex but powerful one in classical mythology. [UNQUOTE]  I’d like to note that these relate back to common IndoEuropean roots.  Also you mentioned Jupiter (Iuppiter) which also is derived from the same IndoEuropean roots (as of course is Zeus and his ancient consort Dione). I have no idea who the "one mythologist" to whom Root refers is, but the concept is interesting — from Deiua Iana to Deiuiana to Diana.  But Root has more to say on this issue in his entry on Janus (Ianus): [QUOTE] Janus was the Roman god with two faces, the god of beginnings, doors, gates and passageways.  Traditionally his name is derived from _ianua_, ‘door’, ‘entrance’, or _ianus_, ‘doorway’, ‘covered passage’.  Attempts have been made to link his name with that of Diana, but for various reasons this seems unlikely.  First, Dianus was relatively late, whereas it should be early if it is to link with her.  Second, he is a native Roman god, whereas she was an imported goddess (from the Greek Artemis). Third, Diana seems to have no connection with doors or two faces.  It could well be, however, that doors and gates came to be associated with Janus (rather than the other way around) because of the similarity between _ianua_ and _ianus_ and his name — which in this case will need another explanation.  We do at least know that the month of January was dedicated to him, not because it was ‘two-faced’, looking back at the old year and forward to at the new, but because it fell between winter and spring [UNQUOTE]  – though why being between winter and spring could not also be "two-faced", I can’t imagine. As to Diana not being a native goddess on the Italian peninsula, Pierre Grimal (in his _Dictionary of Classical Mythology_) writes [in translation] [QUOTE] Diana.  The Italo-Roman goddess identified with Artemis.  This identification seems to have started very early, perhaps in the sixth century BC, through the Greek colonies in southern Italy, and especially through Cumae.  The identification merely overlaid the characteristics of an indigenous goddess, whose own legends were evidently very scanty, for she was worshipped by a people still largely uneducated. [This latter phrase is chauvinistic bull, of course.]  The two oldest of her shrines were the one at Capua, where she went by the name of Diana Tifatina, and the one at Aricia (on the shores of Lake Nemi, near Rome), where she was called Diana Nemorensis, Diana of the Woods. [UNQUOTE]  In checking, just now H.J. Rose’s _Handbook of Greek Mythology Including Its Extension to Rome_ I discovered in his note 80 to chapter XI a probable source for Root’s comments — Rose also points out(1) that Dianus is a late form rather than early, (2) that Ianus is native Roman and Diana not, and (3) Ianus is clearly related to _ianua_.  Rose does write [QUOTE] Not unlike Artemis in many respects was the Italian goddess Diana, who was a deity connected with fertility and childbirth, worshipped in the most ancient cult of which we know anything, and a grove near Nemi, the famous seat of the _rex nemorensis_ or King of the Grove familiar to every one from _The Golden Bough_.  Hence it is not surprising that the Romans identified the two.  The Italian goddess had of course no native statues, so in art the familiar figure of the huntress Artemis (‘Diane chasseresse’) is used for both alike.  The goddess is shown as a young and beautiful woman, wearing buskins, with her chiton girt up to the knee, generally armed with bow and quiver and regularly accompanied by a stag or other beast.  On her head are frequently little crescent-shaped horns, which in later times no doubt stood for the moon with which she was identified, but are no part of her earlier type.  Her emblems, besides attendant beasts and her weapons, include the torch which is a common attribute of goddesses of fertility, from the very common association of light with life or birth. [UNQUOTE]. —       Kice, writing from Lone Tree           "I had seen birth and death,   But had thought they were different;"  – TS Eliot

Response:

"Dianus" is clearly, in Latin, a masculine nominative of  "Diana".  Here’s the entry on "Diana" in Adrian Room’s _Who’s Who in Classical Mythology_ [QUOTE] Diana, the Roman goddess equivalent to the Greek Artemis, has a name that very probably derives from Latin _deus_, ‘god’, as does the name of Zeus.  Traditionally and popularly, she is not only the goddess of hunting, but the goddess of the moon, for which, according to one mythologist, the old Latin name was Jana.  Diana was invoked first as ‘Deiva Jana’ (the goddess Jana), which became ‘Deivjana’ and finally ‘Diana’.  Her name is thus related to that of Janus.  Be that as it may (and one suspects that it may not), we must not overlook that behind these names, and even _deus_ itself, lies the root _di-_ , ‘bright’, so that the overall concept of bright = god = sky = day (Latin _dies_, which also may be behind her name) is a complex but powerful one in classical mythology. [UNQUOTE]  I’d like to note that these relate back to common IndoEuropean roots.  Also you mentioned Jupiter (Iuppiter) which also is derived from the same IndoEuropean roots (as of course is Zeus and his ancient consort Dione). I have no idea who the "one mythologist" to whom Root refers is, but the concept is interesting — from Deiua Iana to Deiuiana to Diana.  But Root has more to say on this issue in his entry on Janus (Ianus): [QUOTE] Janus was the Roman god with two faces, the god of beginnings, doors, gates and passageways.  Traditionally his name is derived from _ianua_, ‘door’, ‘entrance’, or _ianus_, ‘doorway’, ‘covered passage’.  Attempts have been made to link his name with that of Diana, but for various reasons this seems unlikely.  First, Dianus was relatively late, whereas it should be early if it is to link with her.  Second, he is a native Roman god, whereas she was an imported goddess (from the Greek Artemis). Third, Diana seems to have no connection with doors or two faces.  It could well be, however, that doors and gates came to be associated with Janus (rather than the other way around) because of the similarity between _ianua_ and _ianus_ and his name — which in this case will need another explanation.  We do at least know that the month of January was dedicated to him, not because it was ‘two-faced’, looking back at the old year and forward to at the new, but because it fell between winter and spring [UNQUOTE]  – though why being between winter and spring could not also be "two-faced", I can’t imagine. As to Diana not being a native goddess on the Italian peninsula, Pierre Grimal (in his _Dictionary of Classical Mythology_) writes [in translation] [QUOTE] Diana.  The Italo-Roman goddess identified with Artemis.  This identification seems to have started very early, perhaps in the sixth century BC, through the Greek colonies in southern Italy, and especially through Cumae.  The identification merely overlaid the characteristics of an indigenous goddess, whose own legends were evidently very scanty, for she was worshipped by a people still largely uneducated. [This latter phrase is chauvinistic bull, of course.]  The two oldest of her shrines were the one at Capua, where she went by the name of Diana Tifatina, and the one at Aricia (on the shores of Lake Nemi, near Rome), where she was called Diana Nemorensis, Diana of the Woods. [UNQUOTE]  In checking, just now H.J. Rose’s _Handbook of Greek Mythology Including Its Extension to Rome_ I discovered in his note 80 to chapter XI a probable source for Root’s comments — Rose also points out(1) that Dianus is a late form rather than early, (2) that Ianus is native Roman and Diana not, and (3) Ianus is clearly related to _ianua_.  Rose does write [QUOTE] Not unlike Artemis in many respects was the Italian goddess Diana, who was a deity connected with fertility and childbirth, worshipped in the most ancient cult of which we know anything, and a grove near Nemi, the famous seat of the _rex nemorensis_ or King of the Grove familiar to every one from _The Golden Bough_.  Hence it is not surprising that the Romans identified the two.  The Italian goddess had of course no native statues, so in art the familiar figure of the huntress Artemis (‘Diane chasseresse’) is used for both alike.  The goddess is shown as a young and beautiful woman, wearing buskins, with her chiton girt up to the knee, generally armed with bow and quiver and regularly accompanied by a stag or other beast.  On her head are frequently little crescent-shaped horns, which in later times no doubt stood for the moon with which she was identified, but are no part of her earlier type.  Her emblems, besides attendant beasts and her weapons, include the torch which is a common attribute of goddesses of fertility, from the very common association of light with life or birth. [UNQUOTE]. —       Kice, writing from Lone Tree           "I had seen birth and death,   But had thought they were different;"  – TS Eliot

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – There is content regarding Dianus in Raven Grimassi’s book "Hereditary Witchcraft: Secrets of the Old Religion", c1999, Llewellyn Books. I’ve only just started reading the book, so I can’t give you a lot of summary, but the books seems solid so far, if somewhat beginner oriented. Try also Barbara Walker’s book, "Women’s Encyclopaedia of Myths And Secrets". Despite the title, it’s a great reference book. Coyote message Does anyone have any mythological background on the god, Dianus, said to be the consort of the goddess, Diana, in the Italian tradition of Strega Witchcraft? Is it possible that Dianus is an aspect of Diana, or perhaps the god, Janus, or Jupiter? Regards, Jake

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone have any mythological background on the god, Dianus, said to be the consort of the goddess, Diana, in the Italian tradition of Strega Witchcraft? Is it possible that Dianus is an aspect of Diana, or perhaps the god, Janus, or Jupiter? Regards, Jake

Response:

There is content regarding Dianus in Raven Grimassi’s book "Hereditary Witchcraft: Secrets of the Old Religion", c1999, Llewellyn Books. I’ve only just started reading the book, so I can’t give you a lot of summary, but the books seems solid so far, if somewhat beginner oriented. Try also Barbara Walker’s book, "Women’s Encyclopaedia of Myths And Secrets". Despite the title, it’s a great reference book. Coyote – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Does anyone have any mythological background on the god, Dianus, said to be the consort of the goddess, Diana, in the Italian tradition of Strega Witchcraft? Is it possible that Dianus is an aspect of Diana, or perhaps the god, Janus, or Jupiter? Regards, Jake

Response: